How Odie O'Connor Runs Two Pizza Shops From Two States | Pizza King Podcast

I sat down with Odie O'Connor, co-founder of Boxcar Pizza in Portland and Odie's Pizza Co. in Oceanside, California. Odie shares how he went from making vegan pizzas in his backyard to running two sourdough pizza shops across two states — and the systems, partnerships, and mindset that made it possible. Whether you run one shop or are planning your second, this episode has something you can use today.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 1:13

What's going on, Pizza Fam? You are going to love this one. I just wrapped up conversation with Odie O'Connor from Odie's Pizza in Oceanside, California, San Diego area. Also from Boxcar Pizza in Portland. Odie grew up in Buffalo, New York, moved out west, grew spent his teenage years and early years in in Southern California, found his way to Portland working as a tattoo artist and became a vegan and decided he wanted to, you know, just start to make himself some pizza. He couldn't find any any really good vegan pizzas where he was living in the Portland area, so he decided to just take it on himself. That became a passion for him. You know, a couple of years later, what we have now is Odie's Pizza Co, really inspirational inspirational story, just about believing in yourself, taking a chance, learning all of the things that you need to learn and not being afraid to make mistakes, and just putting yourself out there and getting it done. And shout out to Odie for coming through and having a chat with us. And I think you'll really enjoy this one. So Odie O'Connor from Odie's Pizza Co. We don't have to go get all formal. Okay, perfect. How's uh are you guys open every day over there? You open all seven days a week?

SPEAKER_01 2:36

Seven days a week, um 11 to 9, Monday through Thursday, and then or sorry, Sunday through Thursday, and then Friday, Saturday, Saturday, we're open until 10.

SPEAKER_00 2:45

So not not too late.

SPEAKER_01 2:48

Right, yeah. It's kind of there's not like a huge nightlife scene in Oceanside. It's very much like a beach town daytime evening thing, but it's not like people aren't really like raging till late in the night, you know.

SPEAKER_00 3:00

Okay, like you have hotels around you too?

SPEAKER_01 3:03

Yeah, there's some uh definitely some hotels a few blocks away, which is it's great for us. So like we definitely can capture that, those tourists and whatnot. But you know, it's it's nice closing like a little bit earlier too, because then you kind of have peace of mind like going to bed at night. You're like, I'm not gonna get like a phone call at midnight that's like subins are broken in, you know.

SPEAKER_00 3:22

I like that. I'm I'm about to say, well, we're we're eight o'clock. Well, I'm only open six days, but I'm I close at eight o'clock Tuesday through Thursday or Sunday through Thursday, and Friday and Saturday we close at nine.

SPEAKER_01 3:35

What day the week do you close that?

SPEAKER_00 3:37

Close on Monday. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:39

Our first month open, we were closed on Mondays. Um, it was kind of so we could just adjust, you know, we were learning a lot. We we opened right at the beginning of summer. So like we opened and it was just like go, you know, um, much more than we expected, which was like a great thing, but also made it like difficult to figure out like this is what we're doing right, this is what we're doing wrong. So we were closed Mondays, which uh it was nice, like being like, okay, I'm not gonna get like a phone call today. I'm just gonna be able to hopefully chill, but you know, you're always working on something.

SPEAKER_00 4:12

Yeah, I mean, uh a day off is not a day off, it's just a closed day.

SPEAKER_01 4:16

It's just a yeah, exactly. A day with no sales that you're still paying rent.

SPEAKER_00 4:21

Yes, yes, absolutely. But I I could appreciate the mental break. When I took over this shop, we were they were open seven days. I just bought it in January. And it's been, you know, they are open every day, but they weren't doing anything on Monday. And I'm like, what can what can I realistically work if it had to if it was only me working this shop and running it? I'm like, I can do six days, you know, close by eight, nine o'clock every day. And we just started with that. And if we expand, we'll expand, but from there, at least we know we got a little bit of a break into it. Are you running it every single day? No, I'm not. I got a GM. No, dude, it's like like two miles from my house. So I was there. My wife's like, I went to drop the kids off this morning at school, and she's like, Are you coming back? I'm like, my bad. I'm like at the store mopping the floor. I just went to grab some postcards to take to the take to the post office, but then I end up seeing a spot by the door and a mop and it's like an hour later. I'm like, Yeah, I don't have a call until like 1.30, so I'm just gonna be here a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 5:17

Dude, I get that. I I like definitely vibe with that where like I'm gonna stop in real quick and then you're there for a few hours because you're you see something, you're tinkering with something, you're yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:27

What's your what's your role like day to day?

SPEAKER_01 5:31

So uh um uh at my spot up in Portland, boxcar, my day-to-day there is it's it's super hands-off. We opened up in 2020 and I got like a great GM running it. That's a really small shop though, it's 535 square feet. So we only need about two people at a time to run it, which is great. Nice. Down um at Odis in Oceanside. My role day to day, when we opened, it was I was very much um, we're coming up on our one-year anniversary in about 10 days now, actually. Congratulations. Thank you, man. Thank you. So for the first four or five months, it was pretty much in the kitchen every day working on, you know, systems and processes to really streamline processes things so I could eventually not be in there every day. And my business partners were in there as well. You know, it wasn't just me, it's it was like a team effort and training staff, um, training a GM. It's it's interesting opening up a brand new concept and having a full staff and being like, okay, well, there's no like person who's been there a while that can show other people. It's like we're all learning at the same time what's working, what's not working. Nobody really knows like the menu that well. People knew it, but it wasn't like locked in, you know? Yeah. So yeah, the first couple months we're there every day training, figuring out systems processes, but now it's I'm more of um doing social media marketing, working on doing events. We just bought a van to do offsite events. So got three Gosni's, got like the tent, got a cool van with the wraps. So now we're doing private catering events, we're doing like street fairs, stuff like that, trying to get that arm in the business going. So it's great because it's happened pretty fast. Like within the span of a year, it's like I've been able to step out a little bit and work on different things to grow the business. Like I said, like the offsite events, the social media, the marketing, stuff like that.

SPEAKER_00 7:25

I think that is really fast, but most folks spend the first year just trying to figure out if that's even possible.

SPEAKER_01 7:32

Right, dude, right. Um, having my business partners, because they have been partners for 12 years and they've been franchising sandwich shops in San Diego. So they really are dialed in and they have a good headquarters team, operations team. So I've learned so much from them about just how important it is to have systems at your place, to have, you know, a set way that things are done and stick by that every day and make sure everyone's doing the same thing every day. Because that allows you to step away. But but working with my business partners, it really showed me how important all that stuff is to the success of a business. Right.

SPEAKER_00 8:10

So so tell me about how you how you ended up, you know, starting with the shop in Portland and getting back down to getting, I mean, that's a second shop. Usually you don't we don't go next state, you're two states away for second shop. So how do how do you go from Portland to Oceanside?

SPEAKER_01 8:28

Well, so I grew up in San Diego, originally from Buffalo. My family moved when I was 10 from Buffalo to San Diego, and then I moved up to Portland in like 2014. Okay. And that's when I got really into pizza and I was making pizza at home and I started doing pop-ups, and then I opened up um boxcar in 2020 in Portland. And then in like 2023 or 2024, I was really like, man, I want to go back to San Diego. I miss like my family's down here. I really miss the beach. I grew up surfing every day. And then um my business partners, their names are Clayton Wheeler and Craig Applegate. I've known them for 20 some odd years. Like we grew up together down here. Nice. And I was talking with Clayton on the phone, and he was saying that him and Craig wanted to get into pizza. And I was like, dude, I'm trying to get back to San Diego. We started talking about doing a partnership, and it was like, all right, let's make it happen. So I moved back down here, and then we just kind of got the ball rolling.

SPEAKER_00 9:24

So you're doing your thing making pizzas in Portland. Your buddies are doing with their sandwich franchise growing and doing this thing down in Oceanside, and you guys decide, hey, look, let's let's just do it.

SPEAKER_01 9:36

Yeah, yeah. We're like, we could, I mean, we knew we worked really well together because I've known them since, you know, uh we were 10 years old. 38 now, so it's like a long time, you know. So I know like we all knew we were together, we all like genuinely care about each other, which is good, you know. There's at the end of the day, even if we have like a difference of opinion on things, it's not like we're fighting, it's just like we're trying to make the best possible outcome for the business, and we all understand that. And yeah, we just the timing was amazing where I was like, man, I really want to get back down to San Diego, and they were trying to get into pizza, and it was just kind of like serendipitous.

SPEAKER_00 10:15

Was it was it scary knowing that you were gonna move away from the shop that you built there with boxcar?

SPEAKER_01 10:20

Dude, it was terrifying. Leaving, because I was at Boxcar like it definitely six days a week, sometimes seven, just because I was always just like, even if I didn't need to be there, I was just like, oh, I want to go just like check on things, you know? Yeah. But I have a great, great general manager up there who's worked there for years. I have a great team of people there. It's really nice because it's so small, it can run with only a few people, like I had said. So we don't not having a big staff and a ton of different personalities means like things just kind of move a little bit smoother, you know? Less things that can go wrong. It's very um like streamlined and kind of assembly line, where it's we do Detroit style pizza there, so we bake on conveyor ovens and we par bake all of our doughs, every all the ingredients are measured out. So before I left, I tried to make it like as like foolproof as possible, where it's like remove all the questions an employee can have in the day-to-day operations, so then I can feel like comfortable leaving. I still have um bi-weekly meetings with my general manager and my management team down there, and we have an outside accountant. To answer your question, like leaving was terrifying. But these past couple of years has shown me like it's definitely possible. You just have to like make sure you have a great team, great manager, uh, an accountant to make sure the numbers are making sense. But yeah, yeah, so far it's worked out well.

SPEAKER_00 11:47

So, so that one, that concept, both sourdough though, right? But different styles of pizza width from sourdough, right?

SPEAKER_01 11:55

Right, yeah. So um boxcar is Detroit style pizza, and we focus on vegan and gluten-free stuff up there.

SPEAKER_00 12:01

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 12:02

The gluten-free is not sourdough, but we do sourdough, gluten-free, Detroit style pizza. Odie's is more of like a traditional slice shop. We do 16-inch round pies, 10-inch gluten-free pies, and then we do grandma style pies there too. Okay. But yeah, we we still have vegan and gluten-free options at Odis, but our focus is just trying to be like a traditional shop that um does sourdough. San Diego, sourdough hasn't really like caught on a ton here yet. Whereas Portland, it's like really big. And so when I was up there and thinking about moving back to San Diego, and I kind of realized like sourdough isn't really offered down there. And I was talking with Clayton and Craig, my partners, on it. I was like, dude, this would blow. I feel like this would be really well in San Diego because it's people are health conscious and like focused on their health, but it hasn't really caught on. So if we brought it, it it should be pretty sick. And it so far it's worked out really well.

SPEAKER_00 12:57

So, what made you decide to start with sourdough, gluten-free, vegan options in pizza? Because it's almost the hardest path to start from.

SPEAKER_01 13:07

Dude, it is like at the time I was actually vegan myself, and that's how I got into making pizzas. So I was making, you know, pizzas in my backyard and figuring out like how to make vegan pizzas good, you know, trying my hardest doing that. And I started putting pictures on Instagram of pizzas I was making. And then my friend was like up in Portland, he was like, dude, we're having a party, make pizzas here. And then so I went there and I made pizzas, and it they were received really well. So then I started doing pop-ups from there. I was like, Oh, this is something I can do, you know. At the time I was actually tattooing for work, so but I was trying to find a way out of that, and I was like, making pizzas is fun, and then but I was focusing on vegan stuff. And then when you get into like the vegan category or like a kind of like a dietary restriction, I found out really quick that there are more dietary, there's more likely people to have more dietary restrictions in there. So, like, I got a lot of people asked about gluten-free stuff. Um, that I was like, okay, let's figure this out. So we make the gluten-free dough there, and people are really stoked on it. And in Portland, a concept like uh the vegan scene of Portland is huge. So it's like boxcar can do well there. I don't think it would work in every market. Like the big cities like Seattle, I'm sure it would work. I bet New York City it would work, maybe Chicago, but it has to be a certain type of uh of market for, in my opinion, for like a vegan, strictly vegan spot to work.

SPEAKER_00 14:36

Yeah, I think I think solely vegan is is very difficult to execute. Do you have to be, do you have to live a vegan lifestyle to really run a vegan-based business?

SPEAKER_01 14:46

At the time I was vegan. I'm not anymore. Um and I definitely felt like, I mean, it was important for sure because it was important to me. Um, if I were to open up another pizza shop, I mean, I opened up a pizza shop a year ago, but I wouldn't open just another strictly vegan pizza shop. I'm not vegan anymore, you know. Um, so it would feel sort of inauthentic to me. Understood. But, you know, and that's just not where my passion is anymore. It's like now I'm just my passion is for sure like getting Odis, growing it, and just being the best pizza shop we can be. I'm really fortunate to have Boxcar because it allowed me to move down here, but eventually I'm gonna sell it to, you know, one of my employees is really interested in buying it, my general manager. So we've kind of chatted about that. And he's vegan and he's really passionate about it, so it makes sense. You know, I don't think you necessarily have to be vegan to open up a vegan place, but I feel like if you're gonna do it well.

SPEAKER_00 15:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:47

Yeah, if you're gonna do it well, you have to really care about it, you know.

SPEAKER_00 15:50

Understood. I mean, I just nothing against the the I don't even know how to say it, but I think that is really cool, but I know that it's really hard. And and for non-vegan eating folks, it's it's hard to get them to cross over, right? Like I've tried I've tried vegan pizzas or vegan options. Like we all go to the shows. I just seen you in Vegas too. You go to some of these booths and you try some of the like the vegan options, and it's like, I would, dude, I would never eat this. Right. It's not as good. But that doesn't mean that it's not good. It just hasn't, I don't know. I don't even really know what I'm trying to ask there. It just I know that it's hard. I know that it's hard to do it really well. So when you when you live it and you do it, I think it makes a difference.

SPEAKER_01 16:30

Totally. Something I'm really proud of for at Boxcar is we get a lot of omnivores that come in and are like, I just really like this. You know, it's you know, but we do also, especially when we first open and people didn't know about us, and they would come in the door. Um, because it doesn't say vegan pizza on the front. It's very obvious, like on the menu and everything, that everything's vegan, but it just says boxcar pizza out front. So people come in and then they realize, oh, it's a vegan spot and immediately walk out, you know. A lot of people who are omnivores in the beginning, we would get feedback that it's like it's good for vegan pizza. It's not as good as, you know, regular pizza or dairy cheese pizza with real meat and whatnot. And I get that, you know, now that I'm not vegan anymore, it's like, dude, it's really hard to replicate a really good mozzarella cheese. It's really hard to replicate quality pepperonis, sausage, stuff like that.

SPEAKER_00 17:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:20

Vegan people appreciate it for sure, and I think that's why we do well, because we put in the effort, but it's just not going to be as good as normal pizza.

SPEAKER_00 17:28

Yeah. We won't we won't clip that part up. Yeah. Oh man, I'm dismissed right. I read I read somewhere that you actually had a fire on the truck. You started with a truck and you had a like a fire with it on the truck or during service.

SPEAKER_01 17:44

So we had my first pizza business was called Baby Blue Pizza, and I opened that in 2017 or 2018. That's what I was doing pop-ups under. And we I, you know, I started doing pop-ups, eventually got enough money to open up a food truck. The food truck scene in Portland's huge. And so we were at a food park, like it was it didn't move around. We were at like an actual food truck park, and we had a full-sized um wood-fired oven in the truck. Um, and we had this vent up right above the uh where the oven was. And the guy who built the truck didn't put conduit around this wire that was right in the vent. And so this heat was going up from the oven, 700 degree heat, escaping, and it melts this wire. And all of a sudden, it's the middle of service Saturday. It's me and uh my first employee Gus working this busy Saturday afternoon shift, and all of a sudden the lights go off in the truck, and I hear the refrigerators power down. I'm like, what the heck? And I open up the panel, I'm flipping the uh breakers back and forth, and I'm like, what is going on? And I go and I look up the vent, and there's just flames billowing out because that wire melted and caught on fire. And I was like, oh my god, I was like, get out of the truck, get out of the truck, get out of the truck. And I had a fire extinguisher there, and I'm like spraying it up there, and then it went out pretty quick, luckily. But I was like, oh my gosh, I was like, I was so afraid. I walked out of the truck and this guy was out there, he's like, is everything okay? There's like black smoke just shooting up. And I was like, we just caught on fire, yada, yada, yada. But um I learned a lot that day where it's like, you know, it's important to one, it's really important to have a fire extinguisher. You'd have to have that. But like the the guy who built my truck, not putting conduit around that wire where it's like this heat is gonna be escaping here. I mean, I don't know who I would have had check his work because he was a professional, but he can't even fix it, but it was still like, dude, you could have burnt this whole thing down like a month after he opened. Yeah, yeah. But um, yeah, I mean, it's one of those things where now it's just a funny story, and it's just like these things that you run into when you open your own business where you're like, I'm never you never think you're gonna have to cross that bridge or run into this problem, and it's just like any problem that can come your way will eventually come your way.

SPEAKER_00 20:04

It'll find its way to you. It sounds like the fire was the last thing you were expecting. You're flipping breakers.

SPEAKER_01 20:10

Yeah, dude.

SPEAKER_00 20:11

Meanwhile, the truck's about to melt.

SPEAKER_01 20:13

Yeah, yeah. The roof is on fire, and I'm like, why did the electricity go out? You know? But yeah, it's funny now, and it's just like, wow, what a crazy uh it's just such a crazy journey, just the whole time, you know.

SPEAKER_00 20:26

Man, what what were the the early days? Like, do you have in your camera roll like those early pods you were trying out when you were starting to get into it?

SPEAKER_01 20:36

I do, and a lot of times, you know, you're uh if you have an iPhone, it'll be like, remember this? Yeah. And it'll always show me these ones. Um they're terrible, they're so bad. And I look back at them, and it's funny because it's like I didn't know how to make a circular pizza. I didn't know how to properly bake a pizza. I didn't really know that much about different dough hydrations and how to like really achieve the what I was going for, you know. I didn't really even know what I was going for. I was just kind of learning day by day. But those early pizzas are really funny because it's like I remember being so proud of them and being like, this is the best pizza. I'm like, this is incredible. I can't believe I did it, you know. And now looking back, like, wow, that was embarrassingly bad, you know.

SPEAKER_00 21:23

What made you what made you decide pizza? Because this is pre-like pandemic pizza rush where everyone was doing it. This was when there wasn't there was no peer pressure to start making pizza at home in 2014. No one was on the internet influencing you to do that. Why did you do that?

SPEAKER_01 21:39

Yeah. So I uh growing up, I mean, like most kids and definitely kids in Buffalo, like pizza was always my favorite. You know, pizza Friday, my family would always get pizza on Friday, best night of the week. And then uh when I went vegan, I was like kind of it's not to throw shade at any shop in Portland, but there was no one really making good vegan pizza, you know? And so that's when I was like, I'm gonna start making it at home. And then I just got so into it. I just fell in love with the process of, you know, making dough and just learning about all the different things that go into it and how you can achieve different end results of pizza. And there's so many different kinds of pizza. So originally I got into it because I had gone vegan and I wanted to make good vegan pizza, you know, and then I just like fell in love with it. Um, I got a job at this place called Gracie's. Gracie's a pizza up in Portland, and that's where I learned about sourdough, and then I just I ran with it and it just kept snowballing. Nice.

SPEAKER_00 22:34

What were some of the early influences as far as helping you learn how to craft your skill?

SPEAKER_01 22:40

Dude, one of the biggest influences, and he's one of my still one of my best buds to this day, is um Scotty Rivera. He owns Scotty's Pizza up in Portland. All right. What when I was getting in um into pizza, I just emailed him. I'd never met him. I emailed him and another good friend of mine, Will, who had a place called Handsome's Pizzas. Now it's now it's called Harmony's Pizza. It's also up in Portland. But I emailed them both and was just like, hey, I'm really interested in pizza. Can I like buy you guys lunch and just kind of pick your brains? And they were both like, Yeah, let's do it. So cool, just so supportive. And I didn't know what to expect because it's like I'm telling these pizza shop owners that I want to get into pizza. Like, are they gonna be like stay in your lane, you know?

SPEAKER_00 23:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:24

But they were so just like helpful, and we're still really good buds. We still text all the time. When I go up to Portland, a lot of times I'll stay at Scotty's house, you know. So I would say Scotty, Will, this guy, the guy who I worked for, Craig Malilo, who owns Gracie's of Pizza, huge influence. Portland is a huge pizza scene, and it has so much good pizza. And I feel like the rest of the country is kind of finding out about it. It was like definitely a secret for a while. But a pizza shoals is another amazing shop up there. There's a lot of people trying really hard and doing really amazing things. So it's like, you know, that just raises the bar.

SPEAKER_00 24:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:01

But my yeah, top top influences for sure. Scotty's, Gracie's, Harmony's, Red Sauce, Pizza Shoals, all these Portland spots that are just like so dialed.

SPEAKER_00 24:11

That's pretty, that's pretty dope. I'm here, I've never been to Portland, but I obviously I see and hear a lot about the pizza scene. Actually, one of the guys that I talk to a lot in Reno, he he goes back and forth. He's got some buddies in Portland. He's like, man, there's so many shops that I can only get through like four or five every visit, but there's like so many shops in Portland.

SPEAKER_01 24:30

Dude, it's tough to hit them all. You know, there's actually a shop. I don't know if it's in Tampa. I know it's in Florida. I just found it. It's called like Bucks Coal Fired.

SPEAKER_00 24:39

He's down, he's down on the other side, like uh Fort Walton, but yeah. He's not far away. About three, about three hours from here. He's but he's he does some really good, good-looking pizzas. He's a wood fired and he's and he's super creative with it.

SPEAKER_01 24:53

Yeah, yeah. And his social media is great too. He did that like making a pizza every day until Dave Portnoy comes in.

SPEAKER_00 24:59

And then guess who walks in? I know, it's crazy, right? Yeah. But the the good thing about him is you know that when Dave walks in, you better make a good pie, and they do, and they do a good pie all the time, from what I can tell. Totally. I haven't been, but I do see his social and it's it's blowing up. And he gets his team involved, which I love too.

SPEAKER_01 25:19

Totally, totally. Yeah, he looks like he's doing an amazing job. I'm definitely interested in. I've never been to Florida, but it seems like there's definitely a pizza scene there.

SPEAKER_00 25:27

It's growing. It's not, it's for a while, it was like if you want good pizza in Florida, get on 75 and drive as far away as you can. It's like that was like the the running joke. Like, where do I find a good pizza in Tampa? Like, get on 75, drive north for 16 hours, and you'll you'll get one. But uh now there's, you know, because of guys like Portnoy and you know, social media and all of these different things that a lot of shops get highlighted now and ethic is good.

SPEAKER_01 25:56

Yeah, and I love that about like social media too. It's like there's this sort of pizza renaissance happening over the past, you mentioned it, you know, it kind of felt like it hit at the pandemic, but it's really elevating it. And with social media, it's not just like, you know, New York City was thought of as like the pizza spot in you know in the United States. But now it's like, dude, you can go to like pretty much any city and there's gonna be a good spot there, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_00 26:21

Yeah. Now a lot of guys will say that's because someone from Brooklyn came and made pizza and now it's right.

SPEAKER_01 26:27

Yeah. And maybe that's true. I don't know. Who knows?

SPEAKER_00 26:30

I'll just kid. I gotta throw a jab at all my Brooklyn friends. But um, but no, there it I love it because there is great pizza just about anywhere, and it gives you something to do and some, you know, somewhere to go. Um, having a family, like I have a young family, so we travel and we know that wherever we go, we're gonna go try to find some pizza.

SPEAKER_01 26:48

Yeah. I mean, the and the community is so cool. It's like going out to like the expo and you know, running into you, and it's just like, oh hey, what's up, man? It's like everyone's so friendly, and I feel like there's not like this whole idea of like secrecy or like this is my recipe, and I have to like only I can be successful. You know, it's like this thing where I feel like people genuinely want to see their friends succeed and just build a community, you know. I love it. It's like that's one of the things that made me real passionate about it.

SPEAKER_00 27:17

I agree, and it's it's it helps you really keep going. And one of the reasons behind, you know, doing things like this podcast is the community supports the community so well. Run into new in Vegas was pretty cool because you were you were actually competing. How did that go?

SPEAKER_01 27:33

Dude, it was fun. It was my first year competing. I was like really nervous, to be honest with you, as I didn't know what to expect. So I was in um the traditional um category. Originally I wanted to be in the non-traditional. That one fills up pretty quick though. So traditional, just like to give you a quick rundown on it a bit, um, there's like these rules where it's like you have to have red sauce, you can do a cheese blend, um, and you have to have you can only have two of these set ingredients. But if you have like multiple styles of like mushrooms or multiple styles of onions, that only counts as one ingredient. I veered to doing a vegetarian pizza because I was like, maybe this will help me stand out because I feel like most people are gonna do like pepperoni, sausage, stuff like that. So what I did was uh sourd, my sourdough, 48-hour ferment uh crust. We do a 68% hydration on that, red sauce, um, cheese blend with low moisture motts, smoked pro balone, and a sharp cheddar. And then I did what was it? It was like pickled shiitake mushrooms, roasted, uh baby bella mushrooms, and then I did white onions and then uh like candied red onions. So it was kind of a lot going on. Looking back, I think I would have toned it back a little bit. I would have done like probably a meat and a veggie on there. Um, I was like, oh, if I do like multiple onions, multiple mushrooms, it'll be like crazy, you know. But overall, I had a really good time. I placed, it was 20 out of 120 or something like that. That's awesome. Not like I it's not like terrible, but it's not like my goal was like I want to finish on the first half. I want to finish in the first 60 if there's 120. So I accomplished it, you know, the top half, you know. Um, but it is a little anticlimatic, especially turning in the pizza. I'm like, oh, I'm so proud of it. I was like, I'm gonna be top five. And then like you see the list and you're like, well, and you're like all the way down.

SPEAKER_00 29:34

You're like, all right. Did they give did the judges give you like like real feedback that you could use, or was it just a score?

SPEAKER_01 29:43

So it's just a score, and then you have to, it was like a month after you had to email them and be like, hey, can you give me like my rundown sheets, you know? And I almost feel bad for the judges because it's like, dude, imagine eating 120 at least bites of pizza in a day. It's like that's it could be tough. Like in the beginning, you could be really into it, but like halfway through, I imagine, like you get that whatever flavor fatigue, you know. But um, yeah, I mean, things that just like did work, didn't work. I think it was like a little too acidic um with like the pickled stuff. I had like a pretty acidic um uh red sauce on it. Um so I would have, and then also a problem I ran into is I wanted to bake in the Pizza Masters, but it's like they you can't really change the temperatures too much. They have them set, but it's like the the oven that I was baking in was 780 degrees. So that's way hotter than I typically bake. So what I did was I started in that one, I took it out and then I moved it down to one that was 600 for a little while. So I didn't get it as crispy as I would have liked. But you kind of just have, I mean, everyone's facing those challenges, you know, it's not just me because it's like it's my turn to go. The oven's 780 degrees. I can't be like, okay, turn it to 650, and now we're gonna wait 45 minutes so it for it to cool down.

SPEAKER_00 31:08

Just gotta roll with it.

SPEAKER_01 31:10

You just gotta roll with it, but it's fun too, because everyone is um facing the same challenges. Pretty much everyone who was competing or I ran into was super nice. Next year I want I honestly want to be in every category just because it was that it was really fun, it was exciting, and it gave me something to do.

SPEAKER_00 31:28

It's a different type of experience for Expo, and I've never competed. I'm so scared. Like, and I make pizza every day, but I'm so scared to go, I don't know, measure myself. But it's so cool to see how much everyone works together. I was helping my buddy Troy with some, or my buddy Neil with some uh with some video. So it was uh it was a lot of fun just to be back there.

SPEAKER_01 31:52

Dude, it's great, man. I I would really encourage you, right when the Pizza Expo things pop up, just sign up to compete. You don't even enough to know what you're doing, you know, and or like know what pizza you're gonna do. Cause it really pushes you and like it made me feel like I was really a part of expo this year. Whereas before, it's like you go and you walk through the floor and whatnot, and it's like, you know, it's kind of a big advertisement at the end of the day.

SPEAKER_00 32:17

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:18

But you go and you compete and you're like, man, I feel like I I don't know, I was really a part of it, you know. It came here for a reason, right? And even if I finished dead last, it was like, well, I could there's progress to be made, you know.

SPEAKER_00 32:32

And there's a lot of different categories. I think, folks, anyone who doesn't go or hasn't been to Expo, you you it's almost overwhelming by the amount of competitors and you know categories that there are. And then man, I had so many slices just as a spectator. Yeah. It was pretty wild. Like just standing at the end of the table catching slices.

SPEAKER_01 32:53

Yeah, I loved it, dude. Uh my girlfriend and I would keep like stopping by and being like, what slice do they have now? But what one of the guys who won uh his shop is in San Diego, his name's Frank Square Pizzico. I don't know if he won Best Pan or just overall cheese slice, but we saw he won, and then we went out to his shop here and he was there, and then it's like it's kind of like that community aspect too, where I was like, Oh, you're Frank. And he actually knew me too because he had seen me on social media, so he's like, Oh, is your are you Odie? And so we got to talking, and it was like that community thing where it was like, oh, we just went into his shop, he was so cool. We we started chatting, but he won one of the competitions this year, and his pizza was so good. Um, yeah, it was great. It was cool talking to him about him winning too. Just a rad guy, but yeah, Square Pizza Company in in San Diego.

SPEAKER_00 34:38

To check him out. I'm I'm really hoping to make spend some time going south once we head out. We'll be in Anaheim for the show in August. But uh we're not you're not too far from from where from that part of California, so yeah, I'm hoping to make it down.

SPEAKER_01 34:54

Ocean size like the tippy top of San Diego. San Diego's huge, so it's like Anaheim, it's probably like an hour-ish, hour 20.

SPEAKER_00 35:02

So it's not bad at all.

SPEAKER_01 35:04

Yeah, you could make it for sure. And that's not I could give you a list of spots for sure to to hit up. Um San Diego. Most of the spots are in like the city proper, but but yeah, San Diego's definitely the pizza scene's growing and and there's good stuff here for sure.

SPEAKER_00 35:18

Your your social media is pretty dope too. You know, thank you, and seeing that, and even, you know, I saw you you did like pizza on the surfboard and you're out on the street and you're talking to peep people on the beach. I saw you post up some some gift cards. I'm like, damn, I'm just a little bit too far to go grab that before somebody else can see it. But how do you uh know what's the inspiration behind just your your whole approach to social?

SPEAKER_01 35:43

You know, I am just really big on like my name is the is the pizza shop, and I was really big on like I want to just put myself out there, give it 110%. Before I used to be really like the guy is like, oh, I hate to see myself on camera, I hate hearing my voice back, you know. But the more and more you watch videos of yourself and hear your voice recorded, you just kind of get used to it. And I'm just trying to, my approach mostly is when you when I log on Instagram, it seems like it's just one big advertisement, everyone's trying to sell you something. And I was like, how can I break that up a little bit to where it's like someone sees it and doesn't necessarily feel like it's an ad? And that's why I really like the hidden hiding gift cards, you know, the um whatever you call that scavenger hunt, you know. Um, we really like doing giveaways, trying to do funny videos, interviewing people on the street, just stuff to where it's like it feels like it's not just another remake of a of a trendy video or just like another like come in and buy this, you know.

SPEAKER_00 36:45

I like it. I love the trivia because I remember the first time I seen it, it felt like it started so serious. And I thought I was thinking like this is gonna be so serious, and then it's just like, oh, okay. He's gonna great way to give away, like just to just to give back.

SPEAKER_01 37:02

Yeah, thank you, man. Yeah, we try not to be too thank you, dude. Yeah, we we try not to be too serious about it and try and make it like super lighthearted, but yeah, that approach and make just make it super approachable.

SPEAKER_00 37:13

No wrong answers here.

SPEAKER_01 37:16

Exactly, right?

SPEAKER_00 37:18

Yeah. How did so you you said that most of the shops in, you know, around San Diego are you know within the city, but you guys decided to take the take the route of being on the beach and near the beach. What was was that a strategic move or was it based on where where the real estate was available? Like, how did you guys decide that being next to the being beach side was going to be the place to go?

SPEAKER_01 37:39

So we were looking at a bunch of different areas, but we really wanted to be in North County. That's where we all grew up. Grew up surfing, I grew up skating, like right by where the shop is, actually. Um and it was also like what real estate is available. We were looking at a ton of different spots basically over the course of the year, you know, but we were being really picky because we it was like these were there were certain things that we wanted to have. Like we wanted to have a patio, it had to be a certain uh square footage, you know. It had to when we got into lease negotiations, negotiations with the landlord, there had to be certain TI dollars. So we were looking at all these different spots. We were actually in lease negotiations with this different spot, but the landlord was trying to, it was a new build, and then he was trying to shave off some square footage of our of our location, and we really didn't want that. This spot that we ended up in popped up, and it's a second gen spot, and the location's incredible, dude. We're like two blocks up from the beach, and we went and looked at it, and that day we were like, all right, let's let's get this one 100%. You know, we are expanding. So next year we're gonna be opening up a location in San Juan Capistrano, which is just a little bit north, it's like South Orange County. And so we have criteria for that where it's kind of the same idea where it's like we want a patio, we want about 2100 square feet, 2100 to 2,500 square feet. Typically, we're in we're looking at like shopping centers that have like a big anchor tenant, or whether it's like a big grocer or like a really big brand that people know of. Drive some traffic traffic, yeah. Foot traffic is huge, you know, and and and places that there's not a ton of competition. There's pizza everywhere for sure, but like we don't want to be in like this oversaturated area. It's like we'll go somewhere that has like, you know, your your dominoes or pizza huts or stuff like that. But um, we're looking at underserved pizza areas for sure.

SPEAKER_00 39:31

Yeah. So so building building a brand with literally with your name on it in a town where you grew up. What does that do for the ego? You're a man.

SPEAKER_01 39:45

Dude, honestly, that's funny because it's like I am some one of the biggest imposter syndrome guys ever, where it's just like every morning I'm like, well, today's the day everyone's gonna find out I'm a fraud, you know? So it's like, um uh it is cool. It honestly I had to get used to the whole like my name being on the building too, because it's like people come in, like customers come in and we're chatting. And every time I'm like, oh, I'm Odie, I introduce myself. It's always like, You're the guy, you're the guy. And I have you know, I had to like lean into being like, I'm the guy. That's I'm the guy, you know, it's me. Um, but it's yeah, it's funny. I'm working on the imposter syndrome thing, but it's you would think that my head would just like explode and get big with ego, but luckily that hasn't happened yet. But who knows what what'll happen in a couple years.

SPEAKER_00 40:31

No, man, go go open a hundred shops, man. Go go be the go be the man. You're I'll I'll say this, dude. You're way taller in person when I like from looking at you on video and then I meet you and I'm like, oh, thank you, man.

SPEAKER_01 41:22

I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_00 41:23

But no, no ego whatsoever is really cool to meet you in Vegas.

SPEAKER_01 41:27

It is great meeting you in Vegas. And that's one of the best parts about the expo, I think, is like is is meeting the people that you're just like online friends with. You know, you run into them on the show floor and you're like, oh no way. So I love that.

SPEAKER_00 41:41

That's it was one of my favorite part. One of the biggest reasons I go back every year because I ain't buying any equipment. I don't care about I know the products I want, I know how to find them. Totally, dude. I rarely discovered like new things at shows, but it is it is always about the people.

SPEAKER_01 41:57

Dude, 100%. I'm the same way. It's like if if I knew that everyone wasn't gonna be out there, I probably wouldn't go, you know. But you know, it's fun because of the people. It's it's the people who make it what it is. 100%, 100%.

SPEAKER_00 42:09

So we it sounds like we know what's next for for Odie's Pizza Co. Um, another second location. What's what's beyond that?

SPEAKER_01 42:16

So we're continuing. Well, before the second location opens, I'm still working on dialing in like all the processes at the at the flagship store, just so it's when we have two locations, it's not like I'm running back and forth between stores, you know. Um, and then in the meantime, I'm still working on getting like the uh catering side of the business going. That's picking up steam, which is great, getting into summer. So yeah, growing the brand, keep doing the social media catering, and then continuing to open up spots. We're actually taking on some investors and doing a five-store deal over this next couple of years. So

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SPEAKER_01 42:51

we should be opening up five stores in about over the next like two to three years, which is exciting and scary, but um I'm looking forward to it.

SPEAKER_00 42:58

That's pretty dope. Do you guys uh you guys have easy cater out there in San Diego? Or is it are you like how do you sell your caterings?

SPEAKER_01 43:04

Mostly through social media and through like our email list and stuff and just letting people know that that we're there. I I haven't heard of Easy Cater. What's that?

SPEAKER_00 43:13

Easy cater is like it's like Uber Eats and DoorDash are catering, but whoa. With $400 tickets instead of $40 tickets.

SPEAKER_01 43:24

That's awesome. I'm gonna check that out.

SPEAKER_00 43:26

I don't think it's here, but if it's there, I would check it out because it's it's worth a commission. I mean, and you can obviously price the way that you need, but it's a great way to get it out to get the name out into the catering world.

(Cont.) How Odie O'Connor Runs Two Pizza Shops From Two States | Pizza King Podcast

SPEAKER_00 43:38

It's widely used, like here, widely used by like medical sales reps or you know, office managers and folks that just want a marketplace that order something simple and easy and they can order a catering that's delivered. I love it. I'm a big fan of easy catering and I don't they need to sponsor me. They don't. They should, dude. I'm surely a fan of what they do because it it helps it helps close some of those gaps, especially from a sales perspective. Dude, that's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 44:06

We also have we have like a catering manager who she uh she works for my business partners brand or like their restaurant group called Blacktop Restaurant Group. So she does it for Odie's, but she also does it for Boredom Brew, which is their sandwich shops. And she'll um go around to businesses, pass out flyers, pass out her business card, and try and grow it. You know, I didn't I don't want to forget about mentioning KK when you asked about um the catering, and that's her name. So had it, yeah, yeah. Shout out KK or shout out to KK catering manager, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:34

She's making it happen.

SPEAKER_01 44:35

Yeah, she's making it happen.

SPEAKER_00 44:37

Oh, I love that. What's what's we didn't really talk a lot about just oh these pizza in general. What's unique about what you guys do? Other than we know the sourdough is a big is a big deal, sourdough um crust, but what's what's unique about it?

SPEAKER_01 44:54

So, yeah, like you mentioned, like our main driver is the sourdough, but I wanted to take this approach where it's like some people take pizza so seriously where it's like there's the whole, you know, pineapple versus no pineapple. Some people like Fridge Street is really big on like there shouldn't be a ranch on a pizza, you know? Yeah. Our approach is like everything has its time and place on a pizza. Um, I really we love doing like uh like limited, limited offerings where it's like, oh, we're doing uh up at Boxcar, we did like a um Nashville hot chicken pizza. Anything that can be like a sandwich or like a taco is really good on a pizza. Yes. We are neighbors with a taco shop, and we did a uh a biria pizza, a biria special a few months back where we had their birya on top, and you would dip the pizza into the consume, like the side of consume they serve. Like it was so bomb. And so we're just really big on community and like you know, a rising tide lifts all ships and doing collaborations with other local businesses and try and get the word out about both both businesses, you know. And um, but yeah, our our approach is there are really no rules to pizza, and everything has its time and place on a pizza. Heard that.

SPEAKER_00 46:08

Any of the neighbors ever ask you to handle a social media forum?

SPEAKER_01 46:12

People have asked, like, about being in videos, and like a lot of people are like, oh, I love what you're doing, you know. And it's so funny to me because it's like really all you have to do is just record yourself doing something and put it on social media and do that over and over and over again. It's like, I'm not really doing anything, I'm not inventing anything new. I'm just like making it a point to be like, I'm doing these videos this week and planning it out. So it's like really anyone can do it. It's just about like doing it.

SPEAKER_00 46:39

You make it sound easy, but you got really smooth transitions, good intros, good outros on the videos, the background music hits just right. Those are the things you're Learn over time too, though.

SPEAKER_01 46:49

Yeah, for sure. For sure, dude. And I mean, we I I have this dude, Jordan, help me. He films them and he'll edit them too. So it's like, and we pay him, so it's like it's worth its weight in gold with like those professional videos. You know, sometimes I'll just like record on my phone and post something, but it's like we pay him. And so if someone's looking to get like level up their social media game, it's like, dude, pay someone who knows how to record and how to edit, and it makes your life so much easier, and it's just worth his weight in gold.

SPEAKER_00 47:16

That's good advice. Spend a little bit of money and do it the right way. Yeah, for sure. If you can. If not, then just turn the phone on and do it. Right. Any way you can.

SPEAKER_01 47:25

It's like there's no wrong way.

SPEAKER_00 47:27

Yeah, just put it out. There's someone told me a long time ago, you you can never have never have the wrong message for the right person. It'll be I like that. It'll, you know, it'll hit whoever it needs to touch, or it'll touch whoever needs to touch it in the moment. So it's not, it's not always for everybody.

SPEAKER_01 47:41

100%. 100%. And be alright with the fact that like when you put yourself on social media, there are gonna be people, these anonymous accounts that comment on your stuff and they're like, you suck. So it's just don't uh don't take it too seriously and don't listen to the haters too much, and you'll be fine.

SPEAKER_00 47:59

No, man, it's just a pizza shop next door.

SPEAKER_01 48:02

Really?

SPEAKER_00 48:05

Oh man. You're a lot of you're a lot of fun, bro. What so what's your favorite? What's your go-to pizza topping is your topping combination for the pizza you're taking home?

SPEAKER_01 48:16

Man, that's a good question. I've been really into uh pepperoni pineapple jalapeno recently. That one's that one's super bomb. That's really close to mine.

SPEAKER_00 48:26

What's yours? Pepperoni pineapple with banana pepper.

SPEAKER_01 48:30

Dude, that's fire. I I love like the the tweak in peppers too, where it's like the banana peppers, you know. Green chilies, those are another great pepper. But yeah, I mean you can't go wrong with that like salty, sweet, spicy, right? Not in my opinion.

SPEAKER_00 48:45

Yeah, I love it, man. That's that's a lot of fun. Something you've made that that sucked, and you it's you thought it was gonna hit the menu, you thought it was gonna be great, but no one liked it but you.

SPEAKER_01 48:55

Dude, that's a good question. I will say sometimes we'll do specials that I'll be like, this is gonna be the most popular special ever, and I love it, and like it doesn't really hit. Um What is something that has that has been terrible though? So when we s when we opened, we did these things called pizza pockets, where it was basically like our dough, but we stuffed it with cheese or cheese and pepperoni. So you could either do cheese or cheese and pepperoni hot pockets, right? Or pizza pockets, we called them, and we fried them. Um, but it was really hard to do those at scale to where it was like a lot of times they would come out, the cheese wasn't fully melted in the inside, so it was like you were getting like raw cheese sometimes. And so that was really hard to do like effectively and do well. If you're just doing those in your house, it's easy, but it's like when you're doing that in a restaurant during dinner service, it was like almost impossible to do it consistently. So those those came off the menu a few months ago.

SPEAKER_00 49:52

Pizza pockets, we tried, didn't work.

SPEAKER_01 49:54

We tried, didn't work, and we took them off the venue. And honestly, so happy to not have that stressor in my life now.

SPEAKER_00 50:01

That and the fry and the fryers, I'm sure, are very uh appreciative of not having cheese running through them.

SPEAKER_01 50:07

Dude, cheese and then flour, the the uh the oil lasts a lot longer. Um, yeah, it was uh they were a headache and they were not worth their weight.

SPEAKER_00 50:17

So heard that, heard that. If you could give someone some advice, someone looking, someone's in their kitchen like you were 2013, 2014, trying to figure out a path into the pizza business, what advice would you give?

SPEAKER_01 50:29

I mean, the biggest thing is just to show up every day. When I was starting, my goal was like to do one thing every day for the business. So some days it's big where it's like, oh, I registered in LLC my LLC today. And some days it's small to where it's like I just either made a pizza at my house or I post it on my pizza shop's Instagram or like my pizza Instagram, whatever it is, if you don't have a shop yet. Just do something every day, and then uh just know that like when you are feeling like crap and things seem to be really going wrong, that that is most likely happening for everyone. And it's like this too shall pass. And it's like the good, the bad times are gonna pass, but also like the good times are gonna pass too. And it's just keeping an even head and uh just making it through. Great advice.

SPEAKER_00 51:13

Do one thing, just keep it moving forward.

SPEAKER_01 51:16

Yeah, keep it moving forward, one foot in front of the other.

SPEAKER_00 51:18

All right, man. Pizza or a wave, pizza or a surfboard. What's what's what's a better day for you?

SPEAKER_01 51:24

Man, I don't get to surf as much anymore, so I would have to say surfing. But dude, there's something about the ocean, like there, this sounds super woo-woo, but like there are healing powers in the ocean, man. If you can go jump in a body of any body of water and be completely submerged in it, you will come out feeling better. So surfing is, I mean, there's something about it, man.

SPEAKER_00 51:46

We don't we don't get we don't get waves like that here in Florida, especially in the Gulf, but a little bit on the oceanside, but you don't see you don't see much surfing here. More kite boarding, more uh uh paddle board uh life over here.

SPEAKER_01 52:01

The world's best surfer ever, though. Kelly Slater's from Florida, so really yeah, yeah. Kelly Slater. I don't know what part of Florida he's from. It's probably a part that actually gets probably different ways, yeah. Yeah, but uh he's from Florida. Best surfer to ever live.

SPEAKER_00 52:16

Heard that. All right, man. Well, appreciate your time. This was this was really good. Um, you gave some great advice, you got a great story. There's so much we didn't even get a chance to touch on, man, but I won't I won't keep you any longer. Thank you. Odie, tell us where to find you, where to find the shop, where to follow, where to tap into some of the content.

SPEAKER_01 52:34

So um our Instagram is the best way to follow us. At Odie's Pizza is the one in Oceanside at Boxstar Pizza is the one up in Portland. Uh, I have like a pizza Instagram. It's at Young Parmesan. Um Parmesan. Young Parmesan. That's the uh that's the those are the spots, man. And uh I appreciate you having me on, dude. This was great chatting with you, dude. You're an awesome guy.

SPEAKER_00 52:56

No, man, I really appreciate you. Sorry, I was I was a couple minutes late, but uh it was well. Dude, all good, man. You know, uh this was a really good chat. I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 53:03

Yeah, man. It was great talking with you, man. Great knowing you.

SPEAKER_00 53:06

Yes, sir. Hey, hang out one second, let me hit style.